The public sentiment towards US-Pakistan relations is mixed, characterized by skepticism about the genuineness of the alliance and concerns over implications for India. While some commenters express admiration for Pakistan's growing diplomatic ties and criticize US motives, others express frustration over perceived favoritism towards Pakistan and dissatisfaction with India's leadership. Overall, there is apprehension towards the shifting dynamics and the potential impact on regional security.

United States

Pakistan

India

If I had to guess, leverage to get India to stop buying Russian oil

IndependentThink4698

I’d suggest looking at reportage since February 2022 from The Intercept and then DropSite News about Pakistan. Though denied, it is clear that the U.S. at the very least indirectly told Pakistan’s military that overthrowing Imran Khan would lead to better ties. They were quite displeased that Khan went to Russia soon after the invasion of Ukraine and publicly declared neutrality.

IMF shenanigans were provided for Pakistan in exchange for munitions to be sent to Ukraine; munitions that the West does not have the capacity to produce.

Edit: adjusted the last sentence for grammar.

not_GBPirate

The first reason to come to mind is to pressure India with the "stick" over its Russia ties.

But the relations have also improved in their own right notably since the Israel-Iran War. It seems likely that Pakistan helped the US who then helped Israel with intelligence on Iran during the war.

There is also the tertiary motivation to step up engagement so Pakistan doesn't become a Laos-type vassal to China. Pakistan is greatly populated &amp; militarized, giving China access to the Indian Ocean so this is important for the US to compete/counter.

That last reason though only matters because the US feels India does not do enough to counter China particularly in the Pacific (India is against the militarization of the Quad).

Still_There3603

As a Chinese, I think the answer is simple: because Pakistan proved its worth in the air war with India and raised its international status.


If the U.S. continues to do nothing to Pakistan, Pakistan will completely fall back to China (in fact, Pakistan is already deeply cooperating with China politically, economically, and militarily), and the U.S. has nothing to squeeze Pakistan with, so adopting a soft policy is the only option.


The US realizes that India is not strong enough to clamp down on China - they are even at a disadvantage in a military confrontation with Pakistan, so how can they expect India to pressure China?

bjran8888

Daily reminder that the US has supported Pakistan for longer than Israel, still gives them tech and money despite them housing Daniel Pearl’s murder and (of all people) Osama Bin Laden, and even supported them with a nuclear threat WHILE Pakistan was issuing genocidal fatwas to rape and kill non-Muslims in now Bangladesh to the tune of numbers that are only dwarfed by the actual Holocaust in 1971.

IOW, if this is “rapprochement”, then I don’t know what “total and utter ally” is.  I’m only half kidding when I say that Pakistan could potentially nuke Delhi and subsequently issue a fatwa to rape all non Muslim women in Mumbai, and somehow the Americans (and Chinese) would find some way to look past it with hardly a peep from Europe.  Maybe a few “smh” online though.

resuwreckoning

American Deep state always been closer to Pakistan going back 1950s. 

Stupid corporate Dem love Bharat.

PossibleGazelle519

Improving relations with India without fully alienating Pakistan has always been how the USA has done things. 

An alienated Pakistan moves closer to China, while an alienated India moves closer to Russia. 

However, considering how weak Russia is now, perhaps this is shifting, and India moving closer to Russia isn't as much of a concern.

I'm quite interested to see how this all turns out.

mynameakevin

Rumors are rife that Pakistani F-16s might be eligible for V (Blk 70) upgrades.

Clearly, Pakistan is currently in the good books of USA because:

1-Pakistan showed extreme composure and calm and de-escalatory motives during recent Indo Pak clashes even though India attacked Pakistan with absolute no reasoning and got its ass whipped

2-Pakistan downed each of India's top fighter jets, Rafales, MKI, M2K, Mig 29 with no loss of own. Pakistan could have shot down way more. There is nothing India has that can out range Pl15 missiles.

3-USA wasn't expecting this, and US intelligence informed Trump that Indians are about to be sent to oblivion on May 9th, which is what forced USA to get into ceasefire talks

4-USA knows and world knows that Pakistan is a powerful country in south asian and central asian region. India is no where near what it portrays itself to be. India cannot win from Pakistan let alone counter China.

5-Americans have been pretty pissed with Indians, H1Bs, Tech ofshoring etc. So Americans themselves don't have soft corner for Indians anymore

If anything, this is all positive for Pakistan and Pakistan must take this opportunity. Recently, the US EXIMP also approved financing for Reko Diq.....this is rare and rarely US EXIMP banks approve loans for Pakistani projects.

Important-Parsley-38

trump don't like losers.. and when he said 5 jets got shot down, he knows exactly who shot down who.

on and india is too smart for itself, believe in nothing, not aligned with anyone, no full comittment whatsoever, but absolutely takes any tiny small advantage it can.. reselling russian oil, reselling chinese rare earth etc.. earning tiny money but piss off everyone at the same time... but yet still want the benefit from all sides... all that does is that you so smart, no one trusts you, just literally ask anyone about the reputation of indian businessman in the world, never EVER do payment plan with indian businessman, 100% full front cash payment or nothing else, if you dont, your indian buyer's deposit = full payment lol

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I'd rather have allies in most countries than non allies in most countries.

Littlebluepeach

Not at all. When we were involved with Afghanistan, we should have stopped connections with them after the ISI took our money and weapons and gave them to terrorists. I think this was a bad move in policy in hindsight but at the time I understand why we used the ISI

Capable-Balance9330

Pakistan is an issue but India isn’t that much better.

And it’s kind of laughable when you try to portray India as a victim when it treats other non-Hindu civilians in your country like shit LOL.

Finest_Olive_Oil

No not at all, they have an abhorrent human rights record and were of no real help during the Afghanistan war. We give them hundreds of millions of dollars every year and what do we get in return not much at all. 

Also, what are the people of Pakistan getting from all the government aid doesn’t seem to be much they still have constant electricity blackouts and a host of other problems. We should stop aid until things measurably improve. Not our job to fix their country. 

No_Baker6333

Pakistan is *hardly* an ally of America

i’d put them in that cohort of countries like Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Qatar, Egypt. strategic, weak alliances. not like say, America and Britain or America and Israel

we don’t trust them and they don’t trust us, but we get along and occasionally work together on stuff. we can count on them not going off the handle

you need to have those sorts of alliances in that area of the world, the whole thing is a fucking powder keg. this gives us an incredible amount of leverage in controlling things

ecstaticbirch

hell no.

We should use our power as a force for good -- sharia nations should not be allowed to do business in the US, their passports should not be accepted at the border, we should not have embassies or diplomatic relations, US businesses should be prohibited from doing business with them.

I support the US drawing a hard line that we won't even recognize nations that recognize them, you can choose-- you can have a US embassy or a pakistani one, you can't have both.  If you want relations with them you will be fully blocked from doing business with the US in any respect.   
  
I also support a constitutional amendment to prohibit any form of relations with non-democratic nations.

Burner7102

Pakistan is an ally of convenience if anything. I don't think we really trust them in any way.

GreatSoulLord

I think we should have diplomacy and trade with nations, alliances should be based on pragmatism and shared values

What does this have to do with US problems?

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colbert had his show cancelled in america , my friend. A journalist critical of the ruling echelons in Pakistan, Arshad Sharif, was forced to flee Pakistan, forced to be on the run, and then assasinated following multiple hours of torture. The news was then broadcats on all major TV as a thinly veiled threat to anyone whod follow his footsteps. Multiple others (Imran riaz, Sabir Shakir) are on the run and taking refuge in UK and US. so Pakistan is Trump time 100000 and no guard rails present from the judiciary since theyre all compromised.

Background-Ideal-862

He's not saying anything that he's forbidden to speak about just like Pakistani journalists. Tell him to call Apartheid israel an Apartheid state or an ethno-fascist state, he wont. Tell him to call the ongoing Holocaust a Holocaust instead of israel-hamas conflict, he won't. Ask him why the first question he asked Mamdani was if israel has the right to exist even though he's a mayoral candidate and has nothing to do with foreign policy. 

There are things he's allowed and not allowed to talk about. He hasn't said a single thing that hundreds of people haven't already said on national television. Make a post when he actually says something of substance.

hotmugglehealer

Did Colbert term the massacre in Gaza a 'genocide'? As far as I know, he didn't. Has he talked about the much substantiated theory that Epstein was working for Mossad?

Celebrities in Pakistan are afraid of the powerful, and in the same way, celebrities in the US are afraid of the powerful. It's just that the powerful group is different. Trump apparently isn't that powerful for Colbert to have to worry about him. All those American universities who surrendered to the Trump regime, for them Trump was powerful enough.

&gt;And Colbert isn't even supposed to be a political figure. He's a talk show host ffs. But he's not afraid that he'll be kidnapped or ki lled.

Because he won't "be kidnapped or ki lled". Why should he be afraid? Pakistani celebrities don't have that security.

AhmadFarooq

As a Pakistani American living in America, you are far too impressed by the optics. America is a shithole. People here are dying because they can't afford medicine like insulin. The entire society here is built just to enrich the wealthy. There is an American diaspora happening as we speak with many people leaving America to live abroad.

I myself am planning to move to Islamabad shortly.

Our president \*literally\* is a felon, and has credible allegations against him for raping minors. United States kills women and children, and is directly funding the genocide in Gaza.

Pakistan is not America, we have a different structure. But free speech gives us American \*jack shit\*. My taxes are being used to kill children in Gaza and I have no say in it.

America is built and runs on the backs and sweat of everyday working people. We have no middle class in America anymore. Vast majority of the wealth literally is in the hands of 1% of people. The rich live by a different set of rules, trafficking sex slaves with impunity.

Don't be so impressed with America. I have learnt to appreciate Pakistan so much as I grow older and understand geopolitics.

Edit:

America, a country where corruption is LEGAL and enshrined in the LAW. Congress people do insider trading, make millions off information no one else has access to. The judiciary is bought by billionaires, accepting "gifts" worth millions. Entire legislative and executive branch are bought and paid for by lobbying groups like AIPAC.

Our elected officials care more about Israel than their own constituents. 

SCREW America. It's nothing more than a shithole.

Because the state could turn off your channel at a whim, I don't blame the journalist for not speaking the truth I just despise those who justify this censorship. 
Also whatever Colbert says he would not be picked up in the middle of the night etc. trump is a fascist but he still has to play by the rules in that society although I am pretty sure he would want nothing more than have the impunity we have in Pakistan

Environmental-Net-60

I tend to agree with your sentiments but just like people, nations also need time to grow and understand their worth. America was not all sunshine and rainbows. They had several civil wars and 1000s of protests to get to where they are now. America and the west had a very dark history. They learn from their mistakes and become a world power.

 Pakistan was made by intellectuals like Jinnah and Iqbal among other great personalities. Our forefathers fought and believed in Pakistan. Unfortunately, we have been hijacked by dictators and are getting corrupted over time. I am hopeful that our time will change but it also starts from bottom up not top down as many like to believe.

irtiq7

zomboidenjoyer

We just reduced everything to its most simplistic and basic form leaving no room for nuance and layers.

Pakistan army is NOT a US puppet. Pakistan army is heavily influenced by US. There is a gigantic difference.

Pakistan army like any entity has its own interests. When its interests are aligned with US it will do what US wants them to do (hang Bhutto). Sometimes US can also exert pressure and make Pakistan army do things it does not really want to do (fight the taliban). But there are instances when Pakistan army will not listen to US or go against US interest because its in the best interest of Pakistan army (let Osama hide in Pakistan).

Think of it this way. Are you your parents puppet ? People, Organizations and Countries do not exists in a vacuum. They are being influenced all the time by outside forces. This is how the system works. Its a matter of balancing, prioritizing and aligning interests with these outside forces.

1nv1ct0s

Pakistan army has one and only objective. Maintain power and control over the country. Its elites get rich and live well. To that end they will do anything. They are heavily influenced by the US but they've found the level of support needed lacking so they've also run to china.

Shoddy-Reach9232

Not a puppet exactly but US does have and employs its soft power whenever needed

ZainTheOne

It obviously isn’t a puppet. But they haven’t made the best decisions for us either. And of course ppl get recruited whether in the military or in the civilian. It’s complex and a lot of money/power/leverage is used.

As for China, we are fortunate to have a superpower next to us. They are friendly and really we need to get ourselves sorted. There is no reason other than individual greed to align with US but sadly there are many who will accept the cheque.

putoption21

When your assumption leads to a contradiction, that might mean your assumption was wrong

Bibbedibob

It uses both super powers. And enjoys benefits from both of them. Simple.

maowk

In the past, US did not had any issues with China. It's a pretty recent policy shift. The reason being China leveraged the influx of US businesses to accelerate its economic development, ultimately reaching a level of power that has alarmed US &amp; Western nations. 

However, we since the late 1950's have been in a master slave relationship with the US or I would say- always a pro West General was installed that aligned with their foreign policy. We even sided with US in the Vietnam war but did not send troops on ground. We lend them our bases as early as in 1960 when the first ever US spy plane took off from Pakistan to monitor Soviets-which was eventually taken down by Soviets.

Historically, India tended to align with Russians and had a more adversarial stance toward the US due to their support for Pakistan. At the same time, China was also closer to the West. During the Soviet era, we received substantial military funding to combat the Soviets in Afghanistan. After the collapse of the Soviet Union and the rise of China, Western powers began supporting India especially in efforts to counterbalance China.

Military Generals have long played both sides of the wicket. From leveraging relations with China as the strategic neighbor while maintaining ties with the US whose influence in Pakistan is well‑known. Today, following the regime change, Asim Munir and company have publicly reaffirmed alignment with the West. However, behind the scenes, the real game could be different i.e. extract maximum leverage from both Washington and Beijing.

ahsan_shah

We simply could not have won the recent clash with India without Chinese intelligence

arhamshaikhhh

The one thing that the Army is not is incompetent. Pakistan Army just like any other army around the world when they come in to power the main goal and achievement is themselves and not the nation or it's people.
 That is exactly what has happened here, The Army is busy developing its own agendas rather than developing the nation.
For that reason the politicians that come into power are absolutely incompetent and business oriented rather than bureaucrats who work on politics to develop a nation to progress with its.

AqilUSabri

The Pakistan Army is more like a 'dollar army'. The Pakistan Army aligns itself with whoever benefits it the most. Whether it's the USA, China, or the Arab nations, it only cares about its own gain. As long as you are in its interest, the Pakistan Army will stand with you.

Anythingaddict

It simply a propaganda for right wingers and foreign proxies to wage war against Pakistan and to destabilise it, just like they did with Syria, Libya or Lebanon.

No denying we are also incompetent to not cash on opportunities.

Dapper-Two-2299

For everyone who is mad about pakistan giving access to usa for Afghanistan... back we didn't had jf17s and j10s with long range a2a missiles.. we didn't had long range anti air systems like hq9 and hq19s which we now have... America even use to threaten china with its aircraft carriers which is not the case anymore... usa cannot use its military might against pakistan now while in the past that was a possibility so the army did what was best for the country..

Jaysonk98

Despite what others will have you believe they are not puppet of US, nor China. They leverage both for what they see as necessary for pursuing the national interest of the country.

It should be noted that the military has a very different way of describing 'national interest' than what a normal person would. 

Their version of national interest do not include protection, prosperity of the people or democracy. They define national interest as maintaining and enhancing hard power and territorial integrity, without getting too much attention from international powers.

When required they will go against international powers, but they really really prefer not to do so. 

When US creates road block for Pakistan to get advance weapons to enhance hard power they buy it from China, but at the same time they really really don't want to be seen as doing China's bidding or it's proxy same goes for reverse.

Successful-Silver485

You cant buy Pakistan army.. but you can rent it..

pewdiapie

Let me rephrase it for you, The top brass of Pak Army is a puppet of their personal and individual interests and gains instead of the nation they represent.

Zain5633

Generals intrests= money and power ( where it flows they flaws), with a staggering population crossing 240millions, who cares about people.

docshamzee

It's not a puppet... grow up. Our army and government are heavily trying to pursue better relations with America, doesn't make us a puppet.

Latter-Hope-542

They were so ‘phenomenal’ that they were able to hide OBL for years within a mile of their military academy without the CIA getting a whiff of it

panem-et-circenses21

Didn't Pakistan sell nuclear secrets to Iran, Libya, and Nirth Korea?

Negative_Gravitas

I wonder what changed after they hid bin laden for a decade

HeftyArgument

Looks like Pakistan is all set to be used in war against Iran.By US and Israel.

So much for social media accounts with Pakistani flags screeching ‘Free Palestine’ all over social media and on streets…lol

This will be good realization for Pakistan who live in denial and call Zia-Ul-Haq’s murder of Palestinians in Jordan ‘fake news’

Very_Patient

macross1984

Pakistan 🤝America against anti- terrorism ???🤣🤣🤣


Who r you kidding dude. One thrives on terrorism and the other on supplying it.

Griffindor-69

"But hey why doesn't India talk shit about Russia? It isn't as if the US has always backstabbed India."

4th_May

I am calling it now, the alliance with Pakistan is the only US alliance that will survive trump. Why? Because it is the dumbest alliance they have. It ruins the relationship with India and only serves to strengthen china, the real alliance partner of Pakistan. So of course trump will never get rid of it.

printzonic

Lovecraft3XX

And West gives India lectures on how to make decisions

Lonely-Internet-7565

TorontoGiraffe

It is true. They kept Osama Bin Laden under strict surveillance so that he could not create another 9/11.

TheLostRavager

Thankyou west for supporting Us(READ YESTERDAY NEWS) . Now world should see real face of USA

Hot take,  but if a country as insanely theocratic as Pakistan can have nukes and not use them, Iran should probably have one too. MAD is real and maybe Iran and Israel would calm the fuck down with eachother

TRIBETWELVE

Few-Parfait-1432

If Iran state fails, this will likely mess things in the Central Asia very much.

float34

They are ignoring one thing, Pakistan was most important ally to counter Soviet territorial expansion. The whole mess started when religion became key factor for international relationship after collapse of Soviet. Now Pakistan's is going to be played by India and Soviet getting replaced by China.

InterviewTricky7429

I think Pakistan harbouring terrorists to wage a proxy war for Kashmir and Pakistan providing intel and support to terrorists opposed to US security can co exist. Ofcourse US will prioritize its own security over an blanket policy of world peace unless it's threatens it's security. Almost all countries operate from this self centric view. Global geopolitics and alliances are very transient and dynamic.

sandman-blitz

Got it. So he’s trying to be diplomatic as the US wants relationships with both Pakistan and India. 

But this is Reddit so everyone immediately jumps to a conclusion and picks a side that must be right while the other side is terrible.

Betteroffbroke

Pakistan and Murica have actually always had great historical ties and worked on countless counterterrorism ops too both in Pak and Afghan so no surprise. What is surprising is Pakistan is one of those countries maintaining excellent ties with China, good with US and warm with Russia - definitely uniquely positioned from a geopolitical POV

moongroup

The recent meeting between former President Donald Trump and Pakistani leaders marks a significant moment in the warming relations between the US and Pakistan amidst ongoing trade tensions with India.

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